M/S Encoder

[Adler]

Hello all,

I understand the M/S concept but am unsure what benefit the M/S Encoder in Pyramix provides. Can you equalize or compress the Mid and Side signals separately after encoding them?

Thanks,
Chris

[Graemme]

Well, it's nominally designed to deal with already encoded signals and not originally for 'split' M/S processing. I've used the M/S encoder as you describe, routing the strip with the M/S encoder to a pair of internal buses and then those buses to individual mono strips. These mono strips have whichever processing that I want to apply to the M and S signals. The outputs of those mono strips are routed to another set of internal buses and another M/S encoder, which is used to 'decode the M/S back to L/R stereo.The M/S encode/decode processes are 'mirror images' of each other, except for a +6dB amplitude shift in the M/S to L/R direction. This is compensated in the Pyramix M/S Encoder with a 3dB gain loss, by default (So, a -3dB gain for each instance of the M/S encoder used adds up to -6dB gain.)

I haven't built a mixer like this since V4, so the subgroup and aux bus improvements since then may make for a much easier M/S processing chain than I describe above.

A few things:

If you're going to use different dynamics plug-ins (or different settings between two instances of the same plug-in) then make sure that any 'lookahead' delay amounts are identical.

Make sure that latency/delay compensation is fully turned on.

Check your work in mono - sometimes there are nasty surprises when applying M/S processing, especially if you are doing any more than a 1/2 dB of anything. Having said that, perhaps the only use of 'mono' these days is two teenage girls sharing a pair of iPod earbuds...

A really easy setup would be an EQ plug-in that lets you control L/R channels separately. Simply insert this plug-in between two M/S encoders and you're in business. Algorithmix make dual-mono versions of their EQ plug-ins and also make a simple M/S encode decode plug (free!). Flux have a built in M/S encode/decode in the 'Epure' EQ.

Hope this helps a bit...

Graemme

[Adler]

Thank you for the detailed reply, Graemme. I have been looking at the Epure II VST plug-in. How does it compare to EQ-X? Does EQ-X allow M/S processing and split L/R processing?

I appreciate the information.

Chris

[Graemme]

Hi Chris,

To my ears, the Flux Epure and the Merging EQx are *very* similar. There is no built-in M/S encode/decode or split L/R in the EQx.

Graemme

[Adler]

Does the EQ-X use a lot of DSP? I have the VS3 version of Solera and find it to be quite processor intensive.

Also, do you know of any EQs available in the VS3 format which perform split L/R processing?

Thanks again for your insight,
Chris

[fl]

Also, do you know of any EQs available in the VS3 format which perform split L/R processing?

Though not VS3, have a look at the VST plug-ins from Brainworx: http://www.brainworx-music.de/en/plugins

[Perfect Record]

At Frank's recommendation, I go out on stereo aux buss, then return to 2 stereo inputs set as MS decoders. You route one M/S signal to the left input (Mid if I recall), of one stereo strip, the other to the right input of the second input strip. Then EQ whichever signal you wish.

It's very clunky to set up, but it does the job. You should run tones through this setup to make sure your routing does what you want, and levels match. Also, if you are mixing M/S processed tracks with non processed tracks, confirm timing track to track to make sure you don't have any unexpected delays.

Phaseboy Mark has good things to say about izotope Ozone, which has MS processing if I recall.

[Adler]

Thanks everyone for your good suggestions.

Chris