Basic Editing

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AndrewB
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Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Wed Feb 26, 2014 09:00

Returning to Pyramix after an extended period of using other tools elicits a number of simple editing and maneuvering questions:

1) Playhead to Mouse cursor key-combo
Is there a key-click combo that will position the Playhead to Mouse cursor by clicking in the edit pane Timeline ? (For example, using a track ball wastes time scrolling up to the Timescale and back while editing without a jog-wheel.)

2) Gearing Snapping
Snapping to a grid scale or beats etc. without some sort of gearing can be quite tedious. How is this done ?

3) Mouse Scroll Wheel Re-Assignment menu !
Zoom or Timeline-Forward/Back may be used every few seconds, while in some projects Track-up/down scrolling is not at all required. The streamlined (No key-combination required with mouse scroll wheel) Track Scroll is a total waste in this case. It should be re-assignable to avoid a key-combo, (alt) Zoom, for example. The next edit function then could be anticipated with the free hand. (Such an option or menu does not appear under Keyboard Shortcuts).

4) Drag/move Selection without Split
Is there a key-combination to NOT split a selected region when dragging/moving? It is clear that Shift-Click selects multiple clips that can be moved in their entirety. However, a "partially highlighted" region would, in many cases, speed workflow for clips of various lengths to be dragged, shifted, overlapped, x-faded. (Anticipating the X-fade/overlap combo keys is understood...). A good example of usage occurs in close proximity to many clips of various lengths where a "partial highlight" avoids false selections.

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allemano bernard@neuf.fr
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby allemano bernard@neuf.fr » Wed Feb 26, 2014 20:27

Hi,

1) click anywere in the timeline place the playhead cursor where you whant.

2) snap to... in edit menu scrolldown to : snap; and choose what you whant

4) move selection without split : make a selection, and copy it with the "D" key the original clip is not splited

Best regards,

bernard
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby fl » Wed Feb 26, 2014 22:58

AndrewB wrote:1) Playhead to Mouse cursor key-combo
Is there a key-click combo that will position the Playhead to Mouse cursor by clicking in the edit pane Timeline ? (For example, using a track ball wastes time scrolling up to the Timescale and back while editing without a jog-wheel.)


Nope, sorry. There are all the options found in the Cursor and Marks > Nudge Cursor sub-menu, but unfortunately, there is no "Do what I want, not what I tell you." option. The only thing which might make this less painful, is to park your mouse cursor on/near the Cursor scale, then use Control-Alt-PageUP or DOWN to scroll through the Timeline, clicking in the Cursor scale when you get to where you want to be. It's helpful to have a large value, from 2 to 10 seconds, available in the list of Nudge presets, which you can select with a (you guessed it) mouse click on the bottom of the main window. Alternately, you could just use Tab and Shift-Tab to scroll from one edit point or marker to the next/previous. That, at least, brings the Cursor along for the ride. Most of the time, I just type in the timecode location to the cursor location display in the scale at the top.

I suppose you could pepper your Timeline with Track Groups, all of which display their own time scale, but are not able to Zoom freely. Then at least you wouldn't have to move your mouse pointer as far... (Yeah, lame.)

AndrewB wrote:2) Gearing Snapping
Snapping to a grid scale or beats etc. without some sort of gearing can be quite tedious. How is this done ?


Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by "Gearing".

AndrewB wrote:3) Mouse Scroll Wheel Re-Assignment menu !
Zoom or Timeline-Forward/Back may be used every few seconds, while in some projects Track-up/down scrolling is not at all required.


This used to drive me crazy in projects with two to six tracks. I find it useful to click on the little icon in all the Track Headers which looks like a tiny telephone (well, to me), turning it light purple. Now, Track scrolling is disabled.

AndrewB wrote:The streamlined (No key-combination required with mouse scroll wheel) Track Scroll is a total waste in this case. It should be re-assignable to avoid a key-combo, (alt) Zoom, for example. The next edit function then could be anticipated with the free hand. (Such an option or menu does not appear under Keyboard Shortcuts).


Agreed. Perhaps a post in the Suggestions forum...? (Or a direct email to Support.)

AndrewB wrote:4) Drag/move Selection without Split
Is there a key-combination to NOT split a selected region when dragging/moving? It is clear that Shift-Click selects multiple clips that can be moved in their entirety. However, a "partially highlighted" region would, in many cases, speed workflow for clips of various lengths to be dragged, shifted, overlapped, x-faded. (Anticipating the X-fade/overlap combo keys is understood...). A good example of usage occurs in close proximity to many clips of various lengths where a "partial highlight" avoids false selections.


If I understand this correctly, you want to grab a region from a clip (or clips) to be repositioned somewhere else, and you DON'T want it to be split off. I suppose you could just Copy the highlighted area, reposition the cursor and then Paste... Be sure to select the appropriate Track Header before doing the Paste.
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Thu Feb 27, 2014 00:26

allemano bernard@neuf.fr wrote:
1) click anywere in the timeline place the playhead cursor where you whant.



I should point out the differentiation I make between Timeline and Timescale.

Timeline is where the clips reside. Timescale is above where you need to click to move the Playhead. With a trackball, or really any mouse device, it really accumulates (wastes) time moving up then back to the clips to edit.

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Graemme
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby Graemme » Thu Feb 27, 2014 00:28

1) Holding down the 'Q' key while clicking anywhere in the EDL will position the playhead at that point. This is a conditional modifier and you can learn more about it by doing an 'Export Table' command in the key shortcut editor.

2) Don't know...don't use any automatic snap functions. There are manual functions that I do use (Clips/Nudge/Nudge to Next//Previous Edit, etc.) that get me most of that capability when needed.

4) Easy. Hold down the 'D' key and drag your selection to where you want it (in time or across tracks.)

...gb
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Thu Feb 27, 2014 00:48

fl wrote:Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by "Gearing".


Right, good question. I use the term "Geared Snapping" as an analogy to the Jog/Shuttle section (page 133 v8.1) :

Geared Jogging
When checked the jog wheel “gearing” I.e. the amount you have to turn the wheel for a given amount of cursor
movement is related to the current Zoom level.


The snapping options in Pyramix, as I understand them, can be set to frames, ms, beats etc. depending on the scale grid. However when zoomed out, it would be much more appropriate to snap to minutes or seconds instead of milliseconds (or frames etc); measures instead of beats (zoomed out), or even fractions of beats (zoomed in).

This is pretty standard in other software.
Last edited by AndrewB on Thu Feb 27, 2014 03:58, edited 1 time in total.

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AndrewB
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Thu Feb 27, 2014 02:02

Graemme wrote:4) Easy. Hold down the 'D' key and drag your selection to where you want it (in time or across tracks.)


Thanks guys, just tried it now. The Duplicate function does override the split function.

However this does not really solve my workflow. It also seems that I haven't described it very well.

If I need to grab a number of clips on different tracks there is the shift-click function available. However this wastes a large amount of time !

In other software with which I have become extremely fast at editing, there is a drag selection tool that selects clips of varying lengths spread over a number of tracks. The entire clip need not be highlighted, but rather it would be selected entirely with a partial highlight. This is important in cases where clips of different lengths are overlapped or cross-faded with other clips that are not intended to be selected. The selection then could be nudged for a better overlap/cross-fade, or in the case of drum kit, leave small gaps between transient hits to improve a rushed tempo ... and so on. (A practical example is where room or overhead/sectional mics must be split in different locations than close mics, or sustain is different per track...).

With the current drag selection mode, only the highlighted region will be duplicated or split. In this situation a duplication of the clip will get in the way even more than before.

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Re: Basic Editing

Postby Graemme » Thu Feb 27, 2014 03:38

Hold down the shift key and drag-select around any part of any number of clips and they will all be selected. Did you generate the list of key modifiers/commands that I mentioned in point #1 above?
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Re: Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Thu Feb 27, 2014 04:45

Graemme wrote:Hold down the shift key and drag-select around any part of any number of clips and they will all be selected.


That's a Huge difference ! Thanks Graemme. The manual described the shift-drag as breaking grouped-clips while selecting. (I don't recall it mentioning this). It would be nice to be able to set this as the default selection tool, but i guess i can't complain. First of my big frustrations solved. :)

Graemme wrote:Did you generate the list of key modifiers/commands that I mentioned in point #1 above?


Your 'Export Table' suggestion makes it easier to search the key/modifier menus all at once. However, the 'Q ' short cut in EDL didn't work. Is this a custom command?

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Playhead to Mouse Cursor key-combo

Postby AndrewB » Thu Feb 27, 2014 06:22

1) Playhead to Mouse Cursor key-combo

Not in the manual/appendix or the key modifiers/commands.

'Shift-Q + click' in the edit pane Timeline ! Took me half a year to find it. :twisted:

'Q + click' also works sometimes. If a clip is selected then 'Q' jumps to the fade-editor. 'Shift-Q + click' then moves the playhead away from the selected clip and the user can continue with the more simple 'Q + click' until another selection to fade-editor is done.

This is one of the more essential time savers in editing, and I couldn't accept Pyramix was not able to accomplish such a simple task.

P.S. Graemme's EDL playhead jump still sounds useful. We'll figure it out soon.

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Re: Playhead to Mouse Cursor key-combo

Postby Graemme » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:47

AndrewB wrote:1) Playhead to Mouse Cursor key-combo

Not in the manual/appendix or the key modifiers/commands.

'Shift-Q + click' in the edit pane Timeline ! Took me half a year to find it. :twisted:


Which version of Pyramix are you using? I've used plain-ol' 'Q and click' for ages and on several systems. If you've custom programmed any key short-cuts that use the 'Q' key then that might explain why it works 'sometimes' on your system. But honestly, I don't really know.

AndrewB wrote:'Q + click' also works sometimes. If a clip is selected then 'Q' jumps to the fade-editor. 'Shift-Q + click' then moves the playhead away from the selected clip and the user can continue with the more simple 'Q + click' until another selection to fade-editor is done.


Not here, it doesn't (I mean the fade editor bizniz)...(in v8.1.12)

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Re: Basic Editing

Postby fl » Thu Feb 27, 2014 16:50

AndrewB wrote:The manual described the shift-drag as breaking grouped-clips while selecting.


Where in the manual did you see this?

I've always found that Shift-Drag does not break the Clip Grouping - if the drag box touches a clip grouped with any others, all those clips are immediately selected. This leads to a lot of Shift-Clicking on unwanted Clips, or bypassing it all via the right click in the Track Header.

I had assigned "Q" to call the Fade Editor, clearing that restores its Cursor locating ability.

It sure would be nice to be able to edit the mouse-click modifiers...
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Re: Playhead to Mouse Cursor key-combo

Postby AndrewB » Sun Mar 02, 2014 04:02

Graemme wrote:Which version of Pyramix are you using? I've used plain-ol' 'Q and click' for ages and on several systems. If you've custom programmed any key short-cuts that use the 'Q' key then that might explain why it works 'sometimes' on your system. But honestly, I don't really know.


First of all, thanks for the Q-tip :wink:

I may have misunderstood initially. I tried it in the EDL list tab, and didn't work. However it was a break through experiment with the edit/timeline pane.

I previously loaded ver 8.1 and ver 8, to test. Yes to: Pyramix default key-commands when it prompted, and no changes (so it should be one of these two as a default). Export table listed 'Q' as the fade editor prompt (the playhead has to be over the clip, and track or clip selected I believe).

Either way, Q or shift-Q is great ! Two down, a few more Pyramix hopes/concerns to go.

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Re: Basic Editing

Postby AndrewB » Sun Mar 02, 2014 04:27

fl wrote:Where in the manual did you see this?

I've always found that Shift-Drag does not break the Clip Grouping - if the drag box touches a clip grouped with any others, all those clips are immediately selected. This leads to a lot of Shift-Clicking on unwanted Clips, or bypassing it all via the right click in the Track Header.


I've only seen it in the manual, and not actually tested it. There are a number of instances in the manual where the description can easily lead to misunderstanding. This may be one.

Ver 8.1 (page 169) under heading:
"Region Selection"
... When selecting a Clip within a group, the Region is automatically extended to the whole group. This can be avoided by
pressing the Shift key while selecting. A Region can be made by clicking and dragging the mouse across one or
more Tracks.


Your "Tab and Shift-Tab to scroll" suggestion above might come in very handy in the future. Tanx fo dat.

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Re: Basic Editing

Postby fl » Sun Mar 02, 2014 20:38

AndrewB wrote:I've only seen it in the manual, and not actually tested it. There are a number of instances in the manual where the description can easily lead to misunderstanding. This may be one.


I think this is another instance showing how particular Pyramix and the manual can be, regarding the terms used. Selecting a Region is a different proposition from using a so-called "lasso" box to make a Selection.

For the most part, I don't use Region selection much, especially when I'm going after only those Clips residing in specific Tracks - much in the way the original poster of this thread wished to do. Its accuracy is dependent on the zoom level. I don't like how Regions can extend beyond those Clips I intend to grab, particularly if I'm going to perform a Render, or a Cut/Copy and Paste. While I can adjust the Region boundaries after the fact, it's another level of fussing I'd rather avoid.


As for "Q" calling the Fade Editor, that may have come from me originally, as I used this setting in a custom Keyboard Shortcut set-up I've been using for a while.

As a result of this current discussion, I've realized that mouse-click modifiers are among the program settings which a user cannot change. Accordingly, any attempt to create a Keyboard Shortcut which uses a single keystroke should avoid the use of the Q, E, T, A, S, D, F, H, Z, C and V keys, which are already earmarked as mouse-click modifiers.

In some long forgotten post or email, I might have listed my old custom Fade Editor key commands, possibly inspiring others to use the "Q" key to call the Editor. As a public mea culpa, here's my new set-up:

U - Call the Fade Editor (I also have the Button in the top ToolBar)
I - Audition Crossfade
O - Audition Crossfade with Reference
J - Audition Out, without curve, with (to) Reference
K - Audition Out, after Fade, with (from) Reference
L - Audition Out, (all of) Original Material
M - Audition In, before Fade, with (to) Reference
, - Audition In, without curve, with (from) Reference
. - Audition In, (all of) Original Material
Frank Lockwood, Toronto, ON, Canada
http://LockwoodARS.com
• Pyramix Native 11.1.6
• Mac Mini 6.2 (Quadcore i7) - Bootcamp 5.1.5621 - Win7 Pro SP1 64
• HP 7100 Mini-tower - Win10 Pro 64 1809
• RME Fireface 800 ASIO driver 3.125 or ASIO4All 2.13